This is set up for those wanting to chat about Real Estate Investment Trusts (REITs).
Try to keep this chat line open for REIT discussions–only rule is to leave politics aside.
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11/22/2024
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Well, I have not had a gain in these IPO’s the last 2 weeks.
It used to be as right as rain. Regular profits were the norm.
I see the TNX climbing steadily but it’s not the main reason.
My guess is Delta Variant contagion. One extended family member and one client of mine died from Covid this week.
It’s the main conversation in Florida. We have fewer reasons to dine out like we did in May and June. Travel plans are cancelled. I guess hotels are not the place to be invested in as of now.
Is this a new direction, or is it just a minor pullback?
In my corner of florida there is no new panic yet. I hear more about it from the national news and out-of-towners.
My preferreds have been slowly creeping down lately, probably because they were overheated with exuberance. If that trend continues it will eventually be reflected in IPO pricing.
Martin G,
Even today my REIT IPOS are still down.
Watching HYG for clues. Today is a Dead Cat Bounce. (Sorry PETA)
Let’s see what Thursday and Friday look like before I do something rash..
If there’s one thing I learnt about the market, it’s that there are more opportunities waiting.
Today’s good news is that the lawn man finally got around to the Jungle in my backyard.
Whether they go up or down my main strategy doesn’t change. Trade between divergently priced issues. Just takes longer to notice the profits in a down market.
Wow. Going to miss the monthly dividend payments on this underfollowed industrial REIT.
Blackstone REIT to buy WPT Industrial REIT in a deal valued at $1.3 billion in cash
• WPT Industrial Real Estate Investment Trust (OTCQX:WPTIF) and Blackstone Real Estate Income Trust (BREIT) inks an agreement under which BREIT will acquire all outstanding units of WPT for $22.00/Unit, including the debt (about $1.3B).
• The Transaction price represents a 17.1% premium to the closing price of the Units on the TSX on August 6, 2021.
• Net Asset Value per Unit estimate for WPT of $16.66/Unit.
• The Transaction is expected to close in Q4’21.
• “The Board of Trustees of WPT has unanimously determined that the
Transaction is in the best interests of WPT and WPT unitholders and fair to WPT unitholders.”
CLDTPRA vs PEBBP
If called at the earliest, the yields are
Cldt-A (26.80)5.18%
Peb-P (25.34)5.42%
Are those the typical yields we can now expect from Reits?
You can get 6.15% from the very leveraged BRG by locking your funds up for four years in a nontradeable issue at myipo.com. Yow.
Mike D,
I have money in IPO for the Gladstone offer.
BRG was not attractive enough.
Anyone here been able to purchase the new Gladstone Land 6% Series C through their broker?
I tried fixed income desks at Vgd, E*, and TDA. No luck.
Wheeler prospectus wording for 7% pik notes. Any help on the 45% discount? Would they basically pay 3.2% interest ( 45% of the 7% interest) reguardless of the share price? “Interest on the Notes will be payable, at our election, in cash, in shares of our 9% Series B Convertible Preferred Stock (the “Series B Preferred Stock”) based on the Fair Market Value of a share of Series B Preferred Stock (using a trailing average 15-day Volume Weighted Average Closing Price (“15-day VWAP”)), less a 45% discount per share, in an amount equal to the applicable amount of interest for the interest period (rounded up to the nearest whole dollar), or in shares of our 8.75% Series D Cumulative Convertible Preferred Stock (the “Series D Preferred Stock”) based on the Fair Market Value of a share of Series D Preferred Stock (using a trailing average 15-day VWAP), less a 45% discount per share, in an amount equal to the applicable amount of interest for the interest period (rounded up to the nearest whole dollar).”
Classic Brookfield …..
https://d1io3yog0oux5.cloudfront.net/washreit/files/pages/washreit/db/1113/content/WRE+Vertigo+Press+Release+FINAL.pdf
BAM likes to buy strong assets from distressed sellers or at least when the assets are out of favor. The actual buyer will be a private partnership managed by BAM (BAM has many of them) so you can’t invest in it directly. But the way to benefit from all things Brookfield is to buy the parent, BAM on the NYSE.
BAM has its own businesses, plus it earns management fees on all the businesses in which it has an interest, public and private, or manages. A lot of money funnels into BAM.
$10,000 invested in BAM in 2000 would have you with almost $900,000 today. Almost 6 times what an investment in SPY would have done and almost 4 times QQQ. All assume reinvested dividends and ignore taxes.
MNR-C is selling at 25.44 with Ex-Div tomorrow of .3828.
The way these Preferreds are trading, it may be a good buy.
It’s callable on 9-15-21. If called, you bank another .3828
That’s .32 cents for holding 125 days.
Newman- Good eye. 99.9% chance MNR-C is called because of merger. One of the benefits listed by acquirer was calling the preferred to reduce the dividend “expense”. I wouldn’t be surprised to see the price go back up in a few days because people don’t know what they are doing so you might get your 125 day return in 1 week. I was maxed out in this issue but will be watching to sell.
O acquiring VER in all stock deal.
WRI getting bought out 1.408 newly issued shares of Kimco common stock plus $2.89 in cash. Don’t believe the 30+ headline. WRI holders will be trading in for a lower yield.
GEO suspends dividend and will re-evaluate REIT structure
https://seekingalpha.com/news/3679751-geo-group-suspends-quarterly-dividend-for-maximize-debt-repayment-to-evaluate-corporate-structure
Score another big one for the Moron Squad
That’s why I left this comment at SA (and it got posted!):
Bob-in-DE
Today, 1:32 PM
Premium
Comments (455)
@robkrow I’m using my WPG and NGL dividends to buy GEO. I’m expecting my dividends to double.
This makes sense after what CXW did.. I am glad because I own the 2023 GEO bonds at 87 avg cost and they popped today to 93.. they had redeemed the 2022’s w a new 2026 conv issue and the div elim and other plans should make the 2023’s their next target w their debt reduction goals.
Had a similar nice gain in CXW bonds which I sold on their big bounce from 91 to 98. The 2023’s have a ytc of about 9% now and just paid a coupon 4/1. If they trade up to 95ish I will sell as I don’t play much in junk bonds in retirement except as here- a special situation. Bea
GEO is late to this one. CXW did this some months ago. Both really had no choice given the target on their backs.
CXW is a much better run company. I bought CXW debt and sold puts when they plunged late last year. I would not touch GEO at any level.
I got GEO’d today.
I bought some earlier in the year when it hit the 52 wk low. I sold the lot at a small profit after the dividend and started buying back under the new 52 wk low. My position is very small at a whopping $314. I try to average into a position, so I was waiting for more weakness to buy a nibble.
As long as they don’t go banko, I’ll hang in there for now. I was really on a roll this year and knew Mr. Market would be handing me a turd sandwich soon. It is a good reminder to play it safe. We are in nosebleed territory and there are many more GEO’s out there and worse.
people touch a lot of things on III that I would not touch either..but they are ok trades. Bea
Hey hey hey, it’s Hersha
HT-D and HT-E dividends hit my account today.
Now if my Arkansas Razorbacks can make it to the Final Four.
RB
And you get another one soon. The ex date for the normal div is 4/1 payable on 4/15. I went in a little heavy expecting this bump, so I guess I will lighten up after the 1st.
Mixed bag of recent office REIT news. The bad – Mack-Cali CLI continues suspending its dividend for 2021. Not one that I follow anymore, but I understand that CLI is a bit of a hybrid, office and resi. (Not a blue chip like its glory days, and, like the on-the-skids singer in “Tender Mercies”, getting asked questions like “Hey mister, wasn’t you Mac Sledge once?”)
The good – Columbia Property Trust CXP got a bid from an activist group. I am not familiar with CXP, but I have a small position in another office REIT that I hope will get a bump from this type of post-pandemic euphoric bargain hunting.
The uncertain – There is considerable chatter about office values falling in the aftermath of the work-at-home world. There is also reportedly quite a bit of space up for sublease.
Reduced values affect the ability to re-finance and can squeeze out over-leveraged owners. The predictions are schizophrenic. Sample headlines – NYC office values could fall 30%. NYC office market recovering. Take your pick. “Sing it the way you feel it.” — Mac Sledge.
Just my opinion.
CORR-A has dropped less than I would have expected. Management certainly hasn’t demonstrated too much acumen, but is there actually some margin of safety in the preferred that I am missing?
Boston Properties has announced that it will redeem BXP-B, an excellent preferred stock, on 4-1-21.
Hate to lose this one.
Ugh. Saw it dipped below liq pref last Friday, picked up a few shares. Knew the risk but still. Well, I’ll make a $0.02 profit, woo hoo!
I bought well past ex-div. That means I’ll miss any divs paid at redemption, correct?
Cedar Realty CDR “In the second half of 2019, our Board formed a special committee to commence a strategic review process and was actively exploring a sale of the Company at a price of approximately $25 per share (adjusted for the Company’s recent reverse stock split). This strategic review process, in which certain Camac Partners’ director nominees participated directly and of which others were aware, was disrupted due to the outbreak of the COVID-19 pandemic.” CAMAC is genius (well easy when you had insider information), buy it for $1 during bad times knowing this was going to be an outcome they were open to.
Dufus – the CDR story is a very long one, but also a little tragic. Long-term holder of the preferred shares, but Bruce was probably not the best CEO over the past number of years. He took over the company when shares were selling at close to $8 and now claims they could have sold the company for $25 per share, but the price adjusted split is closer to $3.78 per share considering the reverse split. So Bruce took a real estate company selling for $8 and now wanted to sell out for less than $4 per share if my math is correct. Not good work, considering inflation. Bought about 2,500 shares when prices were selling so much lower this past year, but just tempted to sell out later this week and look into better opportunities.
Have to believe the NNN/F will be called in October. These folks are wisely recapitalizing.
https://investors.nnnreit.com/press-releases/news-details/2021/National-Retail-Properties-Inc.-Prices-Offering-Of-450000000-Of-3.500-Senior-Unsecured-Notes-Due-2051/default.aspx
BillW- NNN-F is my largest position. Totally agree it should be called in Oct.I owned it for a long time then sold when YTC was almost 0% and have been buying a lot over the past few months at 3-4+% ytc. Nice place to park cash at right price.
If one only looks at the baby bond/preferred market, one would think that a 5.20% coupon is not sufficient enough cushion to be totally comfortable with the idea that a call in October is a slam dunk certainty… However, as your link demonstrates, there’s a relatively large gap now between the institutional market as defined by issues of 1k denominations and baby bonds and their $25 denoms.. This is not going unnoticed by traditional baby bond issuers, most notably BDC and REIT issuers, and $25 issues are being replaced by institutional money instead of reissuance of new $25’ers…. This is a potential avenue we’ll see more of imho as long as this large disparity continues… I know it’s been mentioned recently by a few other issuers including MNR for its MNR-C which is higher coupon/lesser credit comparable to NNN-F and it’s call date would be 9/15.
Anyone have any thoughts on EQC’s preferred issue? Not callable unless the company is liquidated with a current 5.43% yield. Sam Zell REIT with a large net cash position.
ddy:
EQC – Even with owning only 4 buildings now comprising 1.5 million square feet, EQC is still generating about $3 million in cash flow each quarter. But they are now only getting 30 basis points on their $3 Billion in cash, so interest income has plummeted.
How much longer can they truly justify $7+ million in quarterly G&A expense? They have gone years without making a deal with all their cash – will they ever?
Or will management just keep bleeding the company quarter after quarter with their large corporate overhead expenses?
At some point they should just liquidate and return money to shareholders – correct? One would have to be insane now to be buying their preferred shares at $30+/share, when you would only receive $25 in a liquidation.
That is called return-free risk.
All very valid points. But in my experience, people like Zell don’t let go of a captive pool of capital. I don’t think he will ever liquidate it and just give the money back. He fell into that situation with luck and will eventually do something with the money even if it’s just an average deal. Why let it go when you can do just an average deal and pay yourself and your team with salary, bonus, stock options. In the meantime, the office buildings pay for the G&A, so there is no cash burn/permanent impairment of value. In full disclosure, however, my cost basis is below $25/share.
As expected, Zell not letting go of his free pool of capital. EQC buying MNR. The odds of EQC preferred being redeemed were nil before, and now I figure the odds are 0.00%. EQC preferred’s position in the capital stack is even better, post-merger, and as long as Zell does not over lever NewCo (highly unlikely), the preferred’s should hold their value, imho, barring rate spikes.
Picked up PSA-G and NNN-F today. 4.5% ytw for both of these IG reit preferreds. Fun to look at the “sortable sheet again”.
How do you know when it’s all about selling the service:
https://seekingalpha.com/article/4407180-i-plan-to-own-3-reits-for-generations?v=1613795777&comments=show#comment-88074314
Comment from ron3637:
This is a dangerous article. Look in the comments and you will see author notes that at the current price these are mostly over valued. No emphasis on is placed on this in the write up. Buy high sell low is what this article should be captioned with.
And the reply from Brad Thomas:
@ron3637 Come visit iREIT on Alpha and get all of our “buy below” targets for over 150 stocks… All the best
Put another way, if you want our real advice pay up.
Bob you will like this then. An old friend called today and said he learned about an investment service firm out of Bahamas where they are making 800% returns.
He was wanting to know if I had heard of them. Obviously I hadnt as I already forgot the name. But he was thinking if he could get 500% or so he would be happy with that if he followed them a bit.
I was kinda speechless so I didnt know what to say, as he really knows nothing about the market. He is retired and has plenty of money to live off but knows nothing about the market.I hope he doesnt play too seriously with this. Heck even HDO doesnt promote 800% returns, ha.
Makes HDO look like honest citizens. Just cracking me up their promotion of 25% yielding WPG a month before the company missed an interest payment on a $750 million note issue. And your buddy pendy is still out there defending the recommendation.
Ha, yes I have been reading. And I have been proud of you, Bob. You were jumping into the pillow fight and slapping him around a bit!
100% agree. All may be good companies, but in this market valuation is everything – particularly if you are going to hold “for generations”.
I read a number of the SA authors but I always consider that the article was probably issued a week or two prior to those that pay for it. I’m OK with that relationship frankly – I get value for what I pay (nothing).
billw – I can give you a list of good companies as long as my arm. It’s easy. But the question is should you buy them now? At present prices? In equities entry point is the major determinant of returns in most cases.
True Bob. The SA stuff is just a data point to me. – I’ll take it for the price I pay.
The answers to “should I buy them now” and “at present prices” I definitely do not use SA for.
I posted a comment that didn’t get published. To paraphrase myself, HASI was a great buy at 20-30, where it was earlier in the year. At 60-70, are you really recommending the stock? I really don’t want to own a company at 2-3% CAGR just because it’s a great company.
It’s on my list to look at during the next crash.
Bob – I rarely comment here now, but saw your post this evening. As of today, BT has posted 20 articles already this month and we are on February 20th. Heck, I’ve been looking around the market for the past few months and have only a few stocks that are below my purchase price target, so real slim pickings right now. Here is a quote from his article:
“As CEO of the to-be-formed Thomas Family Office, real estate will definitely be a major asset class held. That includes both private holdings and real estate investment trusts (REITs).”
I’m not sure of the background on some of the SA authors, but if they were really experts in their field, just not sure why they post daily articles on SA for about $35 each – and maybe much less now that the policies have been changed? Buyers beware on SA! He does claim to have an office in Florida now, but certainly would be nice if he provided the location and if he was taking “walk-in” clients for advice.
You’re breaking me up, Lou.
I will be looking for the 13-F filings for the new Thomas family Office.
kaptain, formed my opinion about BT a long time ago. He is no Ernie Pierson (Eureka ) or Hugh Codding ( Santa Rosa ) or maybe Saul.
Codding built shopping centers and surrounded them with rental and residential housing along with being near county government buildings. They sold several of the shopping centers to Simon Group. They kept all the surrounding real estate.
What you need in reits is old school developers like these guys
I signed up for the free 14 day trial and dropped it in the first 30 minutes after searching for some useful info. My best bet he is a failed real estate investor/developer who has tried to reinvent himself a few times. Here is his bio https://www.bradtom.com/my-story/
He is an elite, who recently stated if you don’t go to college, you ‘ain’t nothin’.’
I commented that he ought to talk to Bill Gates and to Steve Jobs’ spirit, since neither finished college. Just wonder what he does when he needs a plumber, an auto repair technician, an electrician, a contractor , etc. – guess he does everything himself, because he went to college.
Interesting letter from L ans B on MNR https://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20210126005851/en/Land-Buildings-Issues-Letter-to-Monmouth-Real-Estate-Shareholders
Full call on BRG.PR.A for 2/26.
Looked at the III website today and just reviewed some of the comments this evening – and certainly know I won’t be back anytime soon. You just have to love 15+ comments on stocks that are traded once a year. Or, are never traded at all.
Today my family members picked up more shares of BFS-E and will continue to buy holdings in the company. The Saul family has very large holdings and the company is very well run. Also, more shares of a small community bank that yields over 6% and reported fantastic numbers this week.
Wishing everyone the best in 2021!
I skip the Illiquid Securities forum. Plenty of other useful things are.
I am truly a sucker for M&M’s and Reeses Peanut Butter cups. As soon as my wife puts them out, I will always be back to the kitchen counter. Every time, I keep telling her (after I grab a handful by the way), that I won’t be back for them, but… she knows me to well. She just winks, and probably whispers to herself that I will be back.
The illiquids are not very useful, … well, until they are. The illiquids are tough to buy and are easier to sell. Many of the investors in this space stuff them in the sock drawers and mattresses, and continue to look for more to stuff in there. Many stocks are hard to sell during a selloff. Why, because everyone else is selling as well. During April sell off, I took a chunk of them (which sold off about 1 div payment), and turned around and bought what I had on one of my lists, called the “high flyers”. This list are the ones that normally trade 8-12% above par price. Take NEE-N for example. Would I normally buy it? No. Would I buy it at par or at $24? Yes. This is one of the many stocks that I bought with my illiquids and ones pinned at par and I have sold them back to folks that would rather pay $28 for it. The fun part will be paying Uncle Sam for the gains.
Awwwwwwwww, poor Mr. C… A friend of mine calls the type of problem you’re facing having to pay Uncle Sam, a “mink coat problem.” Of course today, that invokes animal rights issues so the term should probably be changed to something just as extravagant but not as PC tinged, but the point’s the same – Which mink coat should I wear when I go to the bank? Oh the problems we here are all so fortunate to have to deal with…lol
You are right 2WR. I wanted a lake home on the lake, and my wife wanted a mink coat. Who won out on that one? … We moved in a couple months ago, and am sitting in my new office looking at the lake right now :-).
New investments with low rates are poor… but anyone looking to refi or buy, it is a great time. The jumbo mortgage was dirt cheap.
Ha, Mr. C… We just completed a re-fi a few months ago at 2.25% 15 year and now, sitting here over looking Chickamauga Lake, aka The Tennessee River, with far too much cash and investment rates so low, I’m wondering if I shouldn’t just pay it off – either that or put it all in GME….. oh and just for the record, I don’t think they sell mink coats on QVC otherwise, one of us in this household would already have one….
2WR “Chickamauga Lake Wow?” I never fished there but saw the lake signs many times over the years, as I fished up and down those TVA lakes from Kentucky Lake in Kentucky to Lake Lanier in Georgia, since the 1970’s. Beautiful country and wonderful memories. Those big spotted bass and small mouth should start biting any time now? Wish it was 25 years ago, and I was hooking up the boat trailer. Thanks for helping me remember those days.
lake
I live on Lake Wobegon. We’re all above average there.
There’s a long waiting list, but you could go ahead and apply. You never know.
JMO
Cam, never heard of lake Wobegon before but checked it out. I’m sure my dad now resides there, lost him in 2012. Another great memory on this memorial day. Thanks
camroc–many of us live their.
Its been 3 years now. 2WR, how is lake Chickamauga Lake? You didnt pay off your mortgage did you? Its nice paying a cheap mortgage and instead using the money for investments.
ha! Lake Chickamauga is doing fine, Mr. C. I imagine it’s a lot warmer around here on our lake than on Lake Wobegon, but the stories are much better around yours….lol… We’re still here and we still sit probably 600′ above the lake in a house and grounds too large and too hard to keep up with to justify for just the two of us. And I have to admit, the C in me, Mr. C., is still tempting me to pay off the mortgage despite the low rate vs investment alts, but no, I haven’t and I won’t. Got 7 1/2 years to go and at my age, it’s probably neck and neck as to which will mature first……
Good for you enjoy your new home. We have a timeshare on a beautiful lake in Va. we go every year and really enjoy it. New to this site and a little leary of buying more reits now just looking for a bargain or something good to invest in. Have some in vng and looking at frt . I like apts but not a big deal . Lately been buying into cef’s , have several power co’s. duk and dom like so decided to build my portfolio . Have Maa.PR.I and like it had for a long time ok stock..
saw you buying a home on the lake and had to reply. again enjoy… Scott
Yes Mr C, I dont even bother to say it as I know no matter what I will always come back to the cookie jar. I asked my level headed girl friend and she agrees with me.
Colorado Wealth Management Fund’s contributions on SA all seem to be well-researched and level-headed.
Does anyone here actually subscribe to their service (or know someone who does)?
CWFM is the only contributor on SA I read regularly. I don’t subscribe because of the high price and because I do my own legwork. If I were too busy or uninterested that would be the one service I would buy. He matches my trading style and is very good.
Bur Davis- I was getting useful info from CWM free articles so decided to Join when HOYA joined their group. The Hoya free info was/is pretty good. I signed up for the trial last month and dropped it in 24 hours. Could find zero value in the paid sub. Chat/forum was useless, their data was not good (Tim’s is a lot better here). Also, as a side note I realized the CWM doesn’t even identify himself and couldn’t find any info. Also the 2nd guy who does the BDC info claims to be a CPA and CFP but could not find anyone matching his name to those designations (I might have missed it). They give you the good stuff for free.
I’m a fan of the free info from Hoya. Seems to know what he’s talking about.
Waiting on the billion dollar bullet loan (interest only payments) to start happening. Just take the money.
Add Charles Schwab Co. to the list of those leaving the Golden State.
And these are not fringe players leaving. Schwab is California through-and-through, as is HP. I remember visiting the HP building in Palo Alto in the 1960’s, when the place was a virtual backwater.
right on cue: https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/14/technology/san-francisco-covid-work-moving.html
I’m right behind them. Moving from the Bay Area to Puget Sound this summer when my last kid finishes high school. I’ve enjoyed the last 35 years of living here but I’m done with this state. And I’ll gladly to take the pledge not to bring a single California policy with me.
Welcome up here. It’ll be nice not to have a State income tax, eh? (shhh, not so loud Bur.)
They issued shares(units) in private REITs and paid a fixed dividend on them, then a few years later merged them with WPC at some valuation which determined the number of WPC shares that will be offered for each of those private REIT units. They had many series of private REITs in the past but stopped that practice.
I think they did those mergers so the private REIT unit holders were not left holding illiquid securities. Many other private REITs did not do that and people were left holding junk for years. I think that’s why they have become very unpopular now.
They issued shares(units) in private REITs and paid a fixed dividend on them, then a few years later merged them with WPC at some valuation which determined the number of WPC shares that will be offered for each of those private REIT units. They had many series of private REITs in the past but stopped that practice.
I think they did those mergers so the private REIT unit holders were not left holding illiquid securities. Many other private REITs did not do that and people were left holding junk for years. I think that’s why they have become very unpopular now.
MNR had news yesterday. They will form a group to decide when to sell the corp.
SPLP had major insider buys yesterday on its common and only preferred issue.
SPLPPRA is only at 20.50 but it’s a K1 issuer.
I own MNR common and I will buy SPLP common when there’s a pullback, if any.
SPLP has a beautiful cup formation and the handle may reach a few points higher.
Newman, what’s your take on this news? Chest-beating so as to be seen to be doing something in response to Blackwells’ $18/share offer?
I sold all my MNR at 17.45-17.50 Friday.
I hope I can rebuy them if there is retracement.
I think MNR will be sold. The price, who knows?
But 18 sounds fine, but what if there is a bidding war?
40% of the company is owned by 3 firms.
They want the Landy family out. The Landy family will want more money for the company if they will be ousted.
I thought about options buying, but haven’t pulled the trigger.
Good luck.
Newman – is there any known or rumored reason why you are tying these two things and two companies together? I know of many Allstate tv ads with beautiful cup formations too.. lol
I have to admit, I was ignoring the reference to SPLP. I was asking about the MNR news only because I own some MNR-C.
Bur Davis, Sorry about that.
SPLP-A has a partial redemption due in 3 weeks.
It also had major (qualifying) Insider Buys which almost always is a positive outlook for the company
It did not belong in the REIT CHAT room.
As for MNR-C, I have been overweight on this and assume it will be called in September. At worst , it’s a great alternative to money markets. At best, It has more life.
Newman, I was familiar with the one partial redemption a year or so ago that was baked into the prospectus thanks to Gabelli. But I never heard about this second one?
Gridbird, I just checked and you are right.
I acted on the Insider buy of the preferred on Thursday by Walker Gordon. Mr. Gordon had bought $800,000 of common and $100,000 of the preferred.
There was no partial call.
I wish I could be more focused like you guys.
In the future, I will try to verify my comments.
Newman, You made a mistake? Dang, you were the last man standing. You have now officially joined everybody else on the forum as we all have errored…We collectively welcome you with open arms! 🙂
I thought I was wrong once but I was mistaken
Yeah, MG, I hear ya. I was caught telling the truth once, but I lied my way out of it.
2WR, I have always intermingled different thoughts and ideas when I speak or type.
MNR is a Reit
SPLP is not.
What those two have in common is inside buys that have always influenced my investing. I have done modestly well that way.
Inside buys on companies that have preferred issues are intriguing .
SPLP-A at 20 is tempting.
So apologies for intermingling.
The Cup and handle formation is a well known bullish technical pattern.
I don’t get the Allstate reference unless you mean the coffee mug.
Stay safe
Ha… was just my lame attempt at humor which I guess fell flat…. I knew you were referring to the tech pattern and in response I was referring to the cupped hands in the “You’re in good hands” campaign… As you can probably guess, I’m not a big fan of technical charting analysis, but realize one has to be aware of it because since it has so many believers, it becomes a self fulfilling strategy one has to take into account. I do get a kick out of the ETrade tv add (Is it ETrade?) where two people at an office breakfast service area are talking about an iron condor spread and an iron butterfly spread and the third person chimes in the only spread he’s tried is this cheese spread he’s putting on his toast…
Yeah, the running joke is “There are thousands of charts lying at the bottom of oceans”
I used to use Insider Buys as a factor in my investing. I still do, But I used to , too.
Mitch Hedburg comes to mind.
“I used to do drugs. I still do, but I used to, too.”
-btw your timing looks impeccable on SPLP-A if you went long
on the inside buyer news…up almost 5% on Friday.
-2wr There’s nothing wrong with Newman’s condensed writing style, in fact its refreshing in its brevity. You might consider adopting it yourself.
wasn’t criticizing N’s writing style, CW – was just wondering if he knew something about a potential tie-in between MNR and SPLP given his mention of the two together and MNR’s hiring of investment bankers to explore strategic alternatives.
CW, Thank You for that.
I always had a difficult time writing grammatically correct sentences.
Years ago, my Daughter gave me her English homework to do.
It was a questionaire on what type of sentence I was reading. A simple sentence or a complex one.
I thought, this is easy.
She got a 40% grade on that. She never asked me again.
I don’t always get the answer right the first time. eg, I’m my wifes third husband, but she treats me like #2′.
So win win.
Many moons ago, after acing my high school AP English classes, I wrote my first required weekly essay for my freshman college English class. Brimming with confidence and cockiness, I was floored when the prof returned my paper to me graded with a gigantic, boldly written “F” and the following sentence written in angry red letters across the top: “You have a monumental problem in self expression!” Guess I haven’t learned much in the 57 years since that day. lol
Ouch, teach! Love those ad hominem criticisms. I assume they offered no specific suggestion for improvement, either. Must have been a late night grading…
New to this site,not sure if your the person to ask,but would appreciate if you would direct me were to seek help on my one issue. I held WHLRD for to long. Now I just received a offer to purchase there preferred shares back. Are you or any other members familiar with this issue.And what would your recommendations be.
John – Welcome… Is this the offer you’re referring to??? https://ir.whlr.us/news-events/press-releases/detail/1046/wheeler-real-estate-investment-trust-inc-announces. Personally don’t know WHLR or WHLRD but sounds like it could be an interesting one to research
John – Without doing too much DD, it’s obvious that what you decide to do depends upon your own opinion on the survivability of WHRL, HOWEVER it seems obvious that for this company to survive they are going to have to deal with shareholders of WHLRD not only because of the relative size of the issue but most importantly because shareholders own a PUT on WHRLD that comes into play Sept 2023…
right now shareholders are entitled to roughly $5.46 worth of unpaid dividends…. If nothing is paid until 2023 that amount more then doubles because accrual rate is now greater the 8.75%. That means that if WHLR is to survive they have to pay WHLRD shareholders a total amount exceeding $36/ share upon exercise of put by shareholders (all numbers = rough estimates). So you are in the driver’s seat if WHRL has the ability to save..
There’s an interesting SA article https://seekingalpha.com/article/4372909-wheeler-reit-negative-equity-for-common-shareholders that predates the tender offer and predicts this tender happening and some active insider buying in advance…. so it’s an interesting situation with the tender seemingly being an offer for weak hands while the bravehearted have a great possibility to more than double that price by 2023 if WHRL can survive… I have no idea how deeply in doo doo WHLR really is.. This is a good possible example of the power of the put because the other preferreds do not have it, which is probably another reason why the tender is for the D’s and not the higher coupon WHLRP.
Thank you so much for the clear explanation. I would never have found this out anyhere online.
John – Understand this came from only a very cursory look into the situation and with no feel whatsoever for or prior knowledge of the company and certainly implies no recommendation as to what you should do… Thanks for bringing it up. I looked into it out of curiosity and as a potential opportunity but will probably not pursue it further.. Below is info from the most current 10q you might find helpful to consider. I also see where WHLRD is subject to a 200% asset cover ratio so that makes me rhetorically wonder how this could have a suspended dividend for so long yet theoretically not have violated that coverage ratio…..
Series D Preferred Stock – Redeemable Preferred Stock
At September 30, 2020 and December 31, 2019, the Company had 3,529,293 and 3,600,636 issued, respectively, and 4,000,000 authorized shares of Series D Cumulative Convertible Preferred Stock, without par value (“Series D Preferred”) with a $25.00 liquidation preference per share, or $106.76 million and $101.66 million in aggregate, respectively. Until September 21, 2023, the holders of the Series D Preferred are entitled to receive cumulative cash dividends at a rate of 8.75% per annum of the $25.00 liquidation preference per share (equivalent to the fixed annual amount of $2.1875 per share) (the “Initial Rate”). Commencing September 21, 2023, the holders will be entitled to cumulative cash dividends at an annual dividend rate of the Initial Rate increased by 2% of the liquidation preference per annum on each subsequent anniversary thereafter, subject to a maximum annual dividend rate of 14%. Dividends are payable quarterly in arrears on or before January 15th, April 15th, July 15th and October 15th of each year. On or after September 21, 2021, the Company may, at its option, redeem the Series D Preferred, for cash at a redemption price of $25.00 per share, plus an amount equal to all accrued and unpaid dividends, if any, to and including the redemption date. The holder of the Series D Preferred may convert such shares at any time into shares of the Company’s Common Stock at an initial conversion rate of $16.96 per share of Common Stock. On September 21, 2023, the holders of the Series D Preferred may, at their option, elect to cause the Company to redeem any or all of their shares at a redemption price of $25.00 per share, plus an amount equal to all accrued and unpaid dividends, if any, to and including the redemption date, payable in cash or in shares of Common Stock, or any combination thereof, at the holder’s option.
Dividends on the Series D Preferred cumulate from the end of the most recent dividend period for which dividends have been paid. Dividends on the Series D Preferred cumulate whether or not (i) we have earnings, (ii) there are funds legally available for the payment of such dividends and (iii) such dividends are authorized by our Board of Directors or declared by us. Dividends on the Series D Preferred Stock do not bear interest. If the Company fails to pay any dividend within three (3) business days after the payment date for such dividend, the then-current dividend rate increases following the payment date by an additional 2.0% of the $25.00 stated liquidation preference per share, or $0.50 per annum, until we pay the dividend, subject to our ability to cure the failure. On December 20, 2018, the Company suspended the Series D Preferred dividend. As such, the Series D Preferred shares began accumulating dividends at 10.75% beginning January 1, 2019 and will continue to accumulate dividends at this rate until all accumulated dividends have been paid.
Holders of shares of the Series D Preferred have no voting rights. Pursuant to the Company’s Articles Supplementary, if dividends on the Series D Preferred are in arrears for six or more consecutive quarterly periods (a “Preferred Dividend Default”), the number of directors on our Board of Directors will automatically be increased by two, and holders of shares of the Series D Preferred and the holders of Series A Preferred and Series B Preferred (the Series A Preferred and Series B Preferred together, being the “Parity Preferred Stock”), shall be entitled to vote for the election of two additional directors (the “Series D Preferred Directors”). A Preferred Dividend Default occurred on April 15, 2020. The election of such directors will take place upon the written request of the holders of record of at least 20% of the Series D Preferred Stock and Parity Preferred Stock. The Board of Directors is not permitted to fill the vacancies on the Board of Directors as a result of the failure of the holders of 20% of the Series D Preferred Stock and Parity Preferred Stock to deliver such written request for the election of the Series D Preferred Directors. The Series D Preferred Directors may serve on our Board of Directors, until all unpaid dividends on such Series D Preferred and Parity Preferred Stock, if any, have been paid or declared and a sum sufficient for the payment thereof set apart for payment.
On September 22, 2020, the Operating Partnership purchased 71,343 shares of Series D Preferred at $15.50 per share. These shares are deemed to be retired on the condensed consolidated financial statements. The book value of the shares purchased included both accreted and unaccreted issuance costs and dividends in arrears totaling $1.83 million.
John I also have both D and P shares. On the yahoo board there is conversation if your interested. The company made progress purchasing back shares in a private deal with an investor at I believe 15.50 per share or there abouts. That started a filing with another large holder which I believe they file yearly. All of the insiders in the offer to purchase have indicated that they will be tendering their shares so I expect the dutch auction to be fully subscribed. The company isn’t in the best of shape and that’s putting a positive spin on it, but insiders hold a lot of both pref and common. If push comes to shove, they can take the D and turn it into common shares, but that’s a known going in. I like the method they’re using, just don’t like the terms of how they got the money to do it as the rate is high, but being able to buy at 18 what you issued at 25 is great for the company. Many times with the suspended cumulative issues it seems like a game of chicken so it depends on your individual perspective and of course your cost basis. I’m not personally tendering as that is my objective in buying far out of the money pfd’s. I don’t however expect this one to come current with past dividends any time soon nor to continue to pay at some date but rather to at some future point do another deal or turn them into common. I have never been burned yet by buying pfd shares when insiders are also buying them. FYI the D’s are carried as debt which is why I believe they’re dealing with them at a lower coupon instead of the P’s
You are too articulate for somebody named Dufus
MG, Support the proposition, It may all be Grammarly!
“Please see the Ownership section of our Terms of Service.”
Gives me an idea for an investing app: Investearly…how original, we only take 1%.
Just letting you know the offer was oversubscribed, and more tendered than they can purchase. They are extending offer and buying another mill but still not enough to cover what was tendered by the first due date if everything stays the same, so you may want to consider open market sells if you want to rid yourself of all your shares depending on what you decided to do previously.
They’re moving to Austin (as did 35 other companies in 2020 alone, per https://www.investopedia.com/why-silicon-valley-companies-are-moving-to-texas-5092782), where they’ll find plenny o like-minded folk, I’m sure. And soon, real estate prices to match. You can run but you can’t hide.
Bur, seems Austin real estate prices have already made that leap. Home prices are up 38% over 5 years and 12.8% last year alone. And may still be accelerating into 2021.
i sold my house in austin earlier this year to downsize and dump my mortgage. bought a smaller house since its just the 2 of us in the suburbs. there is literaly a shortage of houses to buy. houses are selling in a day or 2 at full ask with multiple offers.
Yep, sounds just like the SF Bay Area…
Yes Bur,
Thought has crossed my mind too, but its too late for most areas. the California’ns are already there. Plus the growth of population that has no where else to go. My grandkids live in the town of Vancouver Wa. Been driving up there past 4 yrs to see them. Would of been going again this year but for the Covid.
Look before you leap folks. Known a few people who pulled up roots to move elsewhere only to find different problems.
Seatac, Seattle to Bellveue up to Lynwood has rush hr traffic as bad as LA and Bay area.
Portland area is just as bad with its Sprawl.
Drove up Hiway one on the coast last year and drove thru my old college towns of Eureka and Arcata quiet towns, look like nice places but hasn’t changed since Hippie era, still people walking around with surplus army jackets.
At my age one has to think of services like medical. In my job I know of the CHI Franciscan Hosp. expansion in Silverdale and the Asante cancer center expansion in Medford. I have customers in a lot of states. Being only inside salesperson I stop and see a few while on vacation and put a face on the business. I have Idaho on the itinerary and the eastern foothills of the Sierra on the Nevada side if we can get back to traveling safely